How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

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How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Rodrigo Severo - Fábrica
Hi,


Is I set:

smtp_destination_concurrency_limit = 2
smtp_destination_rate_delay = 1s

and send several messages to the same domain will each connection send
one message and wait 1 second (so I would have 2 messages delivered
per second, one from each connection) or both connections to the same
destination domain coordinate themselves and I would have only one
message delivered per second to the destination domain?


Regards,

Rodrigo Severo
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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Wietse Venema
Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:

> Hi,
>
>
> Is I set:
>
> smtp_destination_concurrency_limit = 2
> smtp_destination_rate_delay = 1s
>
> and send several messages to the same domain will each connection send
> one message and wait 1 second (so I would have 2 messages delivered
> per second, one from each connection) or both connections to the same
> destination domain coordinate themselves and I would have only one
> message delivered per second to the destination domain?

Instead of guessing, please read the documentation.
www.postfix.org/postconf.5.html#transport_destination_rate_delay

If the documentation is inaccurate, then it will be fixed.

        Wietse
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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Rodrigo Severo - Fábrica
On Sat, Aug 25, 2018 at 7:08 PM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>> Is I set:
>>
>> smtp_destination_concurrency_limit = 2
>> smtp_destination_rate_delay = 1s
>>
>> and send several messages to the same domain will each connection send
>> one message and wait 1 second (so I would have 2 messages delivered
>> per second, one from each connection) or both connections to the same
>> destination domain coordinate themselves and I would have only one
>> message delivered per second to the destination domain?
>
> Instead of guessing, please read the documentation.
> www.postfix.org/postconf.5.html#transport_destination_rate_delay

I have read the documentation several times. The documentation states
that "With a corresponding per-destination recipient limit > 1, the
rate delay specifies the time between deliveries to the same domain."

What I don't understand is if "the rate delay specifies the time
between deliveries to the same domain" on each simultaneous connection
or if "the rate delay specifies the time between deliveries to the
same domain" across all simultaneous connections.

> If the documentation is inaccurate, then it will be fixed.

Great!


Rodrigo Severo
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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Wietse Venema
Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:

> On Sat, Aug 25, 2018 at 7:08 PM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >>
> >> Is I set:
> >>
> >> smtp_destination_concurrency_limit = 2
> >> smtp_destination_rate_delay = 1s
> >>
> >> and send several messages to the same domain will each connection send
> >> one message and wait 1 second (so I would have 2 messages delivered
> >> per second, one from each connection) or both connections to the same
> >> destination domain coordinate themselves and I would have only one
> >> message delivered per second to the destination domain?
> >
> > Instead of guessing, please read the documentation.
> > www.postfix.org/postconf.5.html#transport_destination_rate_delay
>
> I have read the documentation several times. The documentation states
> that "With a corresponding per-destination recipient limit > 1, the
> rate delay specifies the time between deliveries to the same domain."

Delivery 1 starts, delivery 1 ends, N seconds delay, delivery 2
starts, delivery 2 ends, N seconds delay, delivery 3 starts, delivery
3 ends, and so on.

        Wietse
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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Rodrigo Severo - Fábrica
On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 9:29 AM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
>> On Sat, Aug 25, 2018 at 7:08 PM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> > Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
>> >> Hi,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Is I set:
>> >>
>> >> smtp_destination_concurrency_limit = 2
>> >> smtp_destination_rate_delay = 1s
>> >>
>> >> and send several messages to the same domain will each connection send
>> >> one message and wait 1 second (so I would have 2 messages delivered
>> >> per second, one from each connection) or both connections to the same
>> >> destination domain coordinate themselves and I would have only one
>> >> message delivered per second to the destination domain?
>> >
>> > Instead of guessing, please read the documentation.
>> > www.postfix.org/postconf.5.html#transport_destination_rate_delay
>>
>> I have read the documentation several times. The documentation states
>> that "With a corresponding per-destination recipient limit > 1, the
>> rate delay specifies the time between deliveries to the same domain."
>
> Delivery 1 starts, delivery 1 ends, N seconds delay, delivery 2
> starts, delivery 2 ends, N seconds delay, delivery 3 starts, delivery
> 3 ends, and so on.

My doubt is, having 2 simultaneous connections making deliveries to
the same domain, this process you described happens in each
simultaneous connection (doubling the delivery rate) or all
simultaneous connections delivering to the same domain coordinate so,
no matter how many simultaneous connections I have to the same domain,
only one delivery will occur each N seconds?


Rodrigo
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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Wietse Venema
Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:

> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 9:29 AM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
> >> On Sat, Aug 25, 2018 at 7:08 PM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> > Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
> >> >> Hi,
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Is I set:
> >> >>
> >> >> smtp_destination_concurrency_limit = 2
> >> >> smtp_destination_rate_delay = 1s
> >> >>
> >> >> and send several messages to the same domain will each connection send
> >> >> one message and wait 1 second (so I would have 2 messages delivered
> >> >> per second, one from each connection) or both connections to the same
> >> >> destination domain coordinate themselves and I would have only one
> >> >> message delivered per second to the destination domain?
> >> >
> >> > Instead of guessing, please read the documentation.
> >> > www.postfix.org/postconf.5.html#transport_destination_rate_delay
> >>
> >> I have read the documentation several times. The documentation states
> >> that "With a corresponding per-destination recipient limit > 1, the
> >> rate delay specifies the time between deliveries to the same domain."
> >
> > Delivery 1 starts, delivery 1 ends, N seconds delay, delivery 2
> > starts, delivery 2 ends, N seconds delay, delivery 3 starts, delivery
> > 3 ends, and so on.
>
> My doubt is, having 2 simultaneous connections making deliveries to
> the same domain, this process you described happens in each
> simultaneous connection (doubling the delivery rate) or all
> simultaneous connections delivering to the same domain coordinate so,
> no matter how many simultaneous connections I have to the same domain,
> only one delivery will occur each N seconds?

You are asking about the monster behind the trees. There is no such
monster. Postfix delivers mail exactly as described:

Delivery 1 starts, delivery 1 ends. N seconds delay. Delivery 2
starts, delivery 2 ends. N seconds delay. Delivery 3 starts, delivery
3 ends, and so on.

        Wietse

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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Rodrigo Severo - Fábrica
On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 10:27 AM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
>> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 9:29 AM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> > Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
>> >> On Sat, Aug 25, 2018 at 7:08 PM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> >> > Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
>> >> >> Hi,
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Is I set:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> smtp_destination_concurrency_limit = 2
>> >> >> smtp_destination_rate_delay = 1s
>> >> >>
>> >> >> and send several messages to the same domain will each connection send
>> >> >> one message and wait 1 second (so I would have 2 messages delivered
>> >> >> per second, one from each connection) or both connections to the same
>> >> >> destination domain coordinate themselves and I would have only one
>> >> >> message delivered per second to the destination domain?
>> >> >
>> >> > Instead of guessing, please read the documentation.
>> >> > www.postfix.org/postconf.5.html#transport_destination_rate_delay
>> >>
>> >> I have read the documentation several times. The documentation states
>> >> that "With a corresponding per-destination recipient limit > 1, the
>> >> rate delay specifies the time between deliveries to the same domain."
>> >
>> > Delivery 1 starts, delivery 1 ends, N seconds delay, delivery 2
>> > starts, delivery 2 ends, N seconds delay, delivery 3 starts, delivery
>> > 3 ends, and so on.
>>
>> My doubt is, having 2 simultaneous connections making deliveries to
>> the same domain, this process you described happens in each
>> simultaneous connection (doubling the delivery rate) or all
>> simultaneous connections delivering to the same domain coordinate so,
>> no matter how many simultaneous connections I have to the same domain,
>> only one delivery will occur each N seconds?
>
> You are asking about the monster behind the trees. There is no such
> monster. Postfix delivers mail exactly as described:
>
> Delivery 1 starts, delivery 1 ends. N seconds delay. Delivery 2
> starts, delivery 2 ends. N seconds delay. Delivery 3 starts, delivery
> 3 ends, and so on.

I believe you mean that each simultaneous connection to the same
destination will follow the procedure you described. Thanks for your
clarification.

I think that this info - the delay between deliveries is per
connection and not per, or only, per domain -  should be stated
clearly in the documentation.


Regards,

Rodrigo Severo
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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Wietse Venema
Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:

> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 10:27 AM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
> >> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 9:29 AM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> > Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
> >> >> On Sat, Aug 25, 2018 at 7:08 PM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> >> > Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
> >> >> >> Hi,
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Is I set:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> smtp_destination_concurrency_limit = 2
> >> >> >> smtp_destination_rate_delay = 1s
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> and send several messages to the same domain will each connection send
> >> >> >> one message and wait 1 second (so I would have 2 messages delivered
> >> >> >> per second, one from each connection) or both connections to the same
> >> >> >> destination domain coordinate themselves and I would have only one
> >> >> >> message delivered per second to the destination domain?
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Instead of guessing, please read the documentation.
> >> >> > www.postfix.org/postconf.5.html#transport_destination_rate_delay
> >> >>
> >> >> I have read the documentation several times. The documentation states
> >> >> that "With a corresponding per-destination recipient limit > 1, the
> >> >> rate delay specifies the time between deliveries to the same domain."
> >> >
> >> > Delivery 1 starts, delivery 1 ends, N seconds delay, delivery 2
> >> > starts, delivery 2 ends, N seconds delay, delivery 3 starts, delivery
> >> > 3 ends, and so on.
> >>
> >> My doubt is, having 2 simultaneous connections making deliveries to
> >> the same domain, this process you described happens in each
> >> simultaneous connection (doubling the delivery rate) or all
> >> simultaneous connections delivering to the same domain coordinate so,
> >> no matter how many simultaneous connections I have to the same domain,
> >> only one delivery will occur each N seconds?
> >
> > You are asking about the monster behind the trees. There is no such
> > monster. Postfix delivers mail exactly as described:
> >
> > Delivery 1 starts, delivery 1 ends. N seconds delay. Delivery 2
> > starts, delivery 2 ends. N seconds delay. Delivery 3 starts, delivery
> > 3 ends, and so on.
>
> I believe you mean that each simultaneous connection to the same
> destination will follow the procedure you described. Thanks for your
> clarification.

Absolutely not. I promise that each delivery to that destination
(recipient or domain) will be followed by the per-destination
transport_destination_rate_delay.

> I think that this info - the delay between deliveries is per
> connection and not per, or only, per domain -  should be stated
> clearly in the documentation.

Absolutely not. I promise that each delivery to that destination
(recipient or domain) will be followed by the per-destination
transport_destination_rate_delay.

        Wietse
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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Matus UHLAR - fantomas
>Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
>> I think that this info - the delay between deliveries is per
>> connection and not per, or only, per domain -  should be stated
>> clearly in the documentation.

On 26.08.18 11:08, Wietse Venema wrote:
>Absolutely not. I promise that each delivery to that destination
>(recipient or domain) will be followed by the per-destination
>transport_destination_rate_delay.

so, does transport_destination_concurrency_limit not apply when
transport_destination_rate_delay is >0 ?

--
Matus UHLAR - fantomas, [hidden email] ; http://www.fantomas.sk/
Warning: I wish NOT to receive e-mail advertising to this address.
Varovanie: na tuto adresu chcem NEDOSTAVAT akukolvek reklamnu postu.
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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Wietse Venema
Matus UHLAR - fantomas:

> >Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
> >> I think that this info - the delay between deliveries is per
> >> connection and not per, or only, per domain -  should be stated
> >> clearly in the documentation.
>
> On 26.08.18 11:08, Wietse Venema wrote:
> >Absolutely not. I promise that each delivery to that destination
> >(recipient or domain) will be followed by the per-destination
> >transport_destination_rate_delay.
>
> so, does transport_destination_concurrency_limit not apply when
> transport_destination_rate_delay is >0 ?

There can be no concurrency.

With rate delay, there is an N second delay between the completion
of delivery 1 to the destination, and the start of delivery 2 to
that same destination.

From this it follows that delivery 2 does not start before the rate
delay expires, that delivery 2 does not start before delivery 1 has
completed, and that there is no overlap in time between delivery
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and so on, to that same destination.

You can replace 'email' with 'car', and 'destinion' with 'bridge'.

Imagine counting cars that pass over a bridge. Imagine that car 1
starts crossing the bridge, and that some time later it arrives at
the other side. Then there is an N second delay before car 2 starts
crossing that same bridge.

From this it follows that car 2 does not start crossing the bridge
before the delay has expired, that car 2 does not start crossing
the bridge before car 1 has arrived at the other side, and that
there is no overlap in time that cars 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and
so on, are crossing that same bridge.

        Wietse
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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Rodrigo Severo - Fábrica
On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 2:15 PM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Matus UHLAR - fantomas:
> > >Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
> > >> I think that this info - the delay between deliveries is per
> > >> connection and not per, or only, per domain -  should be stated
> > >> clearly in the documentation.
> >
> > On 26.08.18 11:08, Wietse Venema wrote:
> > >Absolutely not. I promise that each delivery to that destination
> > >(recipient or domain) will be followed by the per-destination
> > >transport_destination_rate_delay.
> >
> > so, does transport_destination_concurrency_limit not apply when
> > transport_destination_rate_delay is >0 ?
>
> There can be no concurrency.
>
> With rate delay, there is an N second delay between the completion
> of delivery 1 to the destination, and the start of delivery 2 to
> that same destination.
>
> From this it follows that delivery 2 does not start before the rate
> delay expires, that delivery 2 does not start before delivery 1 has
> completed, and that there is no overlap in time between delivery
> 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and so on, to that same destination.
>
> You can replace 'email' with 'car', and 'destinion' with 'bridge'.
>
> Imagine counting cars that pass over a bridge. Imagine that car 1
> starts crossing the bridge, and that some time later it arrives at
> the other side. Then there is an N second delay before car 2 starts
> crossing that same bridge.
>
> From this it follows that car 2 does not start crossing the bridge
> before the delay has expired, that car 2 does not start crossing
> the bridge before car 1 has arrived at the other side, and that
> there is no overlap in time that cars 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and
> so on, are crossing that same bridge.

To use your analogy, my doubt is: if a bridge is a destination,
increasing transport_destination_concurrency_limit won't create new
lanes on this same bridge? Increasing
transport_destination_concurrency_limit won't make more cars pass at
the same time on this same bridge?

My doubt is, is I set transport_destination_concurrency_limit = 2 or
transport_destination_concurrency_limit = 3 the flow is the same?
Having set transport_destination_rate_delay > 0, the
transport_destination_concurrency_limit > 1 setting is ignored. Is
that it?


Regards,

Rodrigo Severo
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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Wietse Venema
Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:

> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 2:15 PM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > Matus UHLAR - fantomas:
> > > >Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
> > > >> I think that this info - the delay between deliveries is per
> > > >> connection and not per, or only, per domain -  should be stated
> > > >> clearly in the documentation.
> > >
> > > On 26.08.18 11:08, Wietse Venema wrote:
> > > >Absolutely not. I promise that each delivery to that destination
> > > >(recipient or domain) will be followed by the per-destination
> > > >transport_destination_rate_delay.
> > >
> > > so, does transport_destination_concurrency_limit not apply when
> > > transport_destination_rate_delay is >0 ?
> >
> > There can be no concurrency.
> >
> > With rate delay, there is an N second delay between the completion
> > of delivery 1 to the destination, and the start of delivery 2 to
> > that same destination.
> >
> > From this it follows that delivery 2 does not start before the rate
> > delay expires, that delivery 2 does not start before delivery 1 has
> > completed, and that there is no overlap in time between delivery
> > 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and so on, to that same destination.
> >
> > You can replace 'email' with 'car', and 'destinion' with 'bridge'.
> >
> > Imagine counting cars that pass over a bridge. Imagine that car 1
> > starts crossing the bridge, and that some time later it arrives at
> > the other side. Then there is an N second delay before car 2 starts
> > crossing that same bridge.
> >
> > From this it follows that car 2 does not start crossing the bridge
> > before the delay has expired, that car 2 does not start crossing
> > the bridge before car 1 has arrived at the other side, and that
> > there is no overlap in time that cars 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and
> > so on, are crossing that same bridge.
>
> To use your analogy, my doubt is: if a bridge is a destination,
> increasing transport_destination_concurrency_limit won't create new
> lanes on this same bridge? Increasing
> transport_destination_concurrency_limit won't make more cars pass at
> the same time on this same bridge?

Let me repeat the text from above: there is no overlap in time that
cars 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and so on, are crossing that same
bridge.

To state the obviuos, there can be no more than one car on the bridge.

        Wietse
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Re: How does smtp_destination_concurrency_limit and smtp_destination_rate_delay relate?

Rodrigo Severo - Fábrica
On Mon, Aug 27, 2018 at 10:53 AM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
>> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 2:15 PM, Wietse Venema <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> >
>> > Matus UHLAR - fantomas:
>> > > >Rodrigo Severo - F?brica:
>> > > >> I think that this info - the delay between deliveries is per
>> > > >> connection and not per, or only, per domain -  should be stated
>> > > >> clearly in the documentation.
>> > >
>> > > On 26.08.18 11:08, Wietse Venema wrote:
>> > > >Absolutely not. I promise that each delivery to that destination
>> > > >(recipient or domain) will be followed by the per-destination
>> > > >transport_destination_rate_delay.
>> > >
>> > > so, does transport_destination_concurrency_limit not apply when
>> > > transport_destination_rate_delay is >0 ?
>> >
>> > There can be no concurrency.
>> >
>> > With rate delay, there is an N second delay between the completion
>> > of delivery 1 to the destination, and the start of delivery 2 to
>> > that same destination.
>> >
>> > From this it follows that delivery 2 does not start before the rate
>> > delay expires, that delivery 2 does not start before delivery 1 has
>> > completed, and that there is no overlap in time between delivery
>> > 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and so on, to that same destination.
>> >
>> > You can replace 'email' with 'car', and 'destinion' with 'bridge'.
>> >
>> > Imagine counting cars that pass over a bridge. Imagine that car 1
>> > starts crossing the bridge, and that some time later it arrives at
>> > the other side. Then there is an N second delay before car 2 starts
>> > crossing that same bridge.
>> >
>> > From this it follows that car 2 does not start crossing the bridge
>> > before the delay has expired, that car 2 does not start crossing
>> > the bridge before car 1 has arrived at the other side, and that
>> > there is no overlap in time that cars 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and
>> > so on, are crossing that same bridge.
>>
>> To use your analogy, my doubt is: if a bridge is a destination,
>> increasing transport_destination_concurrency_limit won't create new
>> lanes on this same bridge? Increasing
>> transport_destination_concurrency_limit won't make more cars pass at
>> the same time on this same bridge?
>
> Let me repeat the text from above: there is no overlap in time that
> cars 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, and so on, are crossing that same
> bridge.
>
> To state the obviuos, there can be no more than one car on the bridge.

Ok, so setting  transport_destination_rate_delay > 0 disables
transport_destination_concurrency_limit (or fixes it at 1). I believe
this info could, and should, be stated clearly on the documentation.

Thanks for your help, patience and support.


Regards,

Rodrigo Severo